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10-11-2017, 02:45 AM
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#4096
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 28,569
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Actor
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I, myself, enjoyed it more from 5:20 to the end.
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"Theory is knowledge that doesn't work. Practice is when everything works and you don't know why."
-- Hermann Hesse
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10-11-2017, 04:57 AM
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#4097
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 1,962
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thaskalos
I remember a few years ago...when Dave Schwartz started a fund-raiser here so we could raise some money for Patrick the Truckdriver, when he encountered some emergency medical issues. In a similar vein...I think the time has now come for us to raise a little MORE money...so we could get a private hotel room for Boxcar and Actor. Only THEN will they be able to bring a satisfactory end to this fascinating debate that they've pursued here. Of course, the rest of us won't be privy to the conclusion that they'll reach...but that's a small price for us to pay...IMO.
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I said it before (in post # 8 of this thread), and I'll say it again - with Boxcar in the mix, any discussion of religion takes a back seat to his intolerant ranting of his interpretation of the Bible.
As Barney on the Simpson's once famously stated, "Jesus is spinning in his grave...."
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10-11-2017, 10:31 AM
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#4098
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 46,884
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Parkview_Pirate
I said it before (in post # 8 of this thread), and I'll say it again - with Boxcar in the mix, any discussion of religion takes a back seat to his intolerant ranting of his interpretation of the Bible.
As Barney on the Simpson's once famously stated, "Jesus is spinning in his grave...."
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Someone should have given Barney a bible, then he would have known that Jesus beat the grave on the third day. Or is that, too, just my "interpretation"? 
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Consistent profits can only be made on the basis of analysis that is far from obvious to the majority. - anonymous guru
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10-11-2017, 10:36 AM
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#4099
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 46,884
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Actor
If you want to stay one one topic then I'll oblige. Name your poison.
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Stay focused. How many times have I asked you to back up your claim that Jesus failed both tests for a true prophet in Deut 13 and 18? Why don't you get to work on that? One of your favorite skeptics' sites should be able to help you out on this.
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Consistent profits can only be made on the basis of analysis that is far from obvious to the majority. - anonymous guru
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10-11-2017, 01:07 PM
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#4100
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Librocubicularist
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Ohio
Posts: 10,466
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boxcar
Stay focused. How many times have I asked you to back up your claim that Jesus failed both tests for a true prophet in Deut 13 and 18? Why don't you get to work on that? One of your favorite skeptics' sites should be able to help you out on this. |
A false prophet would ask his followers to follow other gods and Jesus did exactly that, the other god being himself.
A false prophet would promise to perform miracles but fail. We know he failed because miracles are impossible.
So if Jesus existed, and if the Jews (not the Romans) killed him they were only carrying out OT law.
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Sapere aude
Last edited by Actor; 10-11-2017 at 01:08 PM.
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10-11-2017, 01:20 PM
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#4101
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 930
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I just read a few of your posts, Actor, and you don't apply sound reasoning with cogent arguments. An example would be how you are using your own terms to spin away from what your "opposition" (I don' think they are, for the sake of this though I'm saying that) maintains.
"We know miracles are impossible" is just a silly thing to say, for hundreds of reasons. The first reason is that it's just a language or definitional problem that you bring baggage into (a closed mind). Unless you can explain everything that has ever happened in humanity, it is a silly assertion to say that something is "impossible." Particularly in metaphysical discussions.
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10-11-2017, 02:01 PM
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#4102
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Librocubicularist
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Ohio
Posts: 10,466
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LemonSoupKid
"We know miracles are impossible" is just a silly thing to say, for hundreds of reasons. The first reason is that it's just a language or definitional problem that you bring baggage into (a closed mind).
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How so?
The definition of a miracle is "the suspension of the laws of science on behalf of a petitioner who is undeserving."
Quote:
Originally Posted by LemonSoupKid
Unless you can explain everything that has ever happened in humanity, it is a silly assertion to say that something is "impossible." Particularly in metaphysical discussions.
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What do you mean by "explain everything that has ever happened in humanity?" Do you require an explanation of how every atom in every human that ever lived got to where it is today? Or would an explanation of the principles which govern the motion of atoms suffice? Or something in between?
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Sapere aude
Last edited by Actor; 10-11-2017 at 02:02 PM.
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10-11-2017, 03:40 PM
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#4103
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 46,884
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Actor
A false prophet would ask his followers to follow other gods and Jesus did exactly that, the other god being himself.
A false prophet would promise to perform miracles but fail. We know he failed because miracles are impossible.
So if Jesus existed, and if the Jews (not the Romans) killed him they were only carrying out OT law.
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Wrong on both accounts. Numerous scriptures attest to the occurrence of miracles. And secondly, those same scriptures attest to the divinity of the Son of David (a/k/a Jesus Christ).
And before you tell me that the scriptures prove nothing, I would remind you that your own lame theories prove nothing.
And since you KNOW miracles are impossible, then Shirley U. will have no problem proving this to us.
Oh yeah...one more thing before I let you off the hook this easily: The ancient Jews presumed miracles were possible for many reasons. Even v.1 in Deut 13 bears this truth out. Moses did not rule out the possibility of miracles -- even by false prophets.
__________________
Consistent profits can only be made on the basis of analysis that is far from obvious to the majority. - anonymous guru
Last edited by boxcar; 10-11-2017 at 03:46 PM.
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10-11-2017, 07:55 PM
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#4104
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Librocubicularist
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Ohio
Posts: 10,466
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boxcar
Wrong on both accounts. Numerous scriptures attest to the occurrence of miracles.
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Scripture still proves nothing.
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Sapere aude
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10-11-2017, 08:01 PM
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#4105
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Librocubicularist
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Ohio
Posts: 10,466
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LemonSoupKid
I just read a few of your posts, Actor, and you don't apply sound reasoning with cogent arguments.
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Give me a cogent argument argument that any deity exists, then give me a cogent argument argument that said deity is the only deity, then give me a cogent argument that said unique deity is the Judeo-Christian-Islamic deity.
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Sapere aude
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10-11-2017, 08:20 PM
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#4106
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Librocubicularist
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Ohio
Posts: 10,466
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boxcar
And since you KNOW miracles are impossible, then Shirley U. will have no problem proving this to us.
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How about you proving something for a change. Pick any one of your lame theories and prove it.
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Sapere aude
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10-11-2017, 08:27 PM
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#4107
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 46,884
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Actor
Scripture still proves nothing.
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Of course. And if scripture didn't teach the things I mentioned earlier, then your retort would be that scripture doesn't support Christian theology. Heads you win, or tails you win. Must be nice to be in a win-win situation. But...before you break out the bubbly to celebrate your enviable position, prove to us that the supernatural is impossible since you claim to know this for a fact.
__________________
Consistent profits can only be made on the basis of analysis that is far from obvious to the majority. - anonymous guru
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10-11-2017, 10:20 PM
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#4108
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: St. Louis suburb
Posts: 1,761
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Actor
I have read Twain's Personal Recollections of Joan of Arc. Have you found something earth shaking in that?
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No need to raise the drawbridge. Like others, I merely thought the time and research invested in what would become his favorite work, devoted to someone who claimed, "We must act when God wills it” in the context of military victory, a bit curious.
On the other hand, I wouldn't think "the common eye sees only the outside of things, and judges by that, but the seeing eye pierces through and reads the heart and the soul, finding there capacities which the outside didn't indicate or promise, and which the other kind of eye couldn't detect”, to be earth shaking for you coming from Twain, since reading the heart and soul can't be quantified.
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"I like to come here (Saratoga) every year to visit my money." ---Joe E. Lewis
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10-11-2017, 11:22 PM
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#4109
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Librocubicularist
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Ohio
Posts: 10,466
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boxcar
And if scripture didn't teach the things I mentioned earlier, then your retort would be that scripture doesn't support Christian theology.
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What scripture supports or does not support is irrelevant.
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Sapere aude
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10-12-2017, 03:12 AM
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#4110
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Librocubicularist
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Ohio
Posts: 10,466
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boxcar
I know all too well what "equivocation" is. It's when one uses equivocal language with the intention to deceive.
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Define "equivocal?"
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Sapere aude
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