The Amazing Stewards Screw Up AGAIN in California. This is a good one.

[Andy Asaro]

Originally Posted by oughtoh

Anyone know who the stewards at Del Mar will be?

Unless something is done about them the same crew will go to Del Mar. Last year was the fake dead heat controversy.

[thaskalos]

Where is Vic Stauffer, to tell us how "demanding" the track steward's job is?

[ReplayRandall]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

Where is Vic Stauffer, to tell us how "demanding" the track steward's job is?

Where's Vic??----->BANNED

[Andy Asaro]

Originally Posted by ReplayRandall

Where's Vic??----->BANNED

WIN PLACE SHOW TV Series - The Team Captains

http://winplaceshowtv.com/captains.html

Excerpt:

VIC STAUFFER

"Making the correct bet is the goal, not necessarily picking the winner".
2 Eclipse Awards for Radio Achievement. Multiple handicapping tournament wins.

[ReplayRandall]

Originally Posted by Andy Asaro

WIN PLACE SHOW TV Series - The Team Captains

http://winplaceshowtv.com/captains.html

Excerpt:

VIC STAUFFER

"Making the correct bet is the goal, not necessarily picking the winner".
2 Eclipse Awards for Radio Achievement. Multiple handicapping tournament wins.

You're way late to the party, Andy. Posted the following about Vic, as we've played in tourneys against each other for the last few years:

http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/s...d.php?t=134649

[oughtoh]

They have had those stewards at Del Mar for the last 10 years. Lets just not have stewards at all.

[Andy Asaro]

Originally Posted by ReplayRandall

You're way late to the party, Andy. Posted the following about Vic, as we've played in tourneys against each other for the last few years:

http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/s...d.php?t=134649

Right. This is a reality show.

[ReplayRandall]

Originally Posted by Andy Asaro

Right. This is a reality show.

Yep, and what Vic and I do every single day is real life.....BTW, I wish Vic wasn't banned from this site.

[cj]

Originally Posted by Andy Asaro

Right. This is a reality show.

Reality shows are the farthest thing from reality possible.

[cj]

Originally Posted by ReplayRandall

Yep, and what Vic and I do every single day is real life.....BTW, I wish Vic wasn't banned from this site.

Vic worked hard for his banning.

[jimmyb]

Originally Posted by ReplayRandall

Where's Vic??----->BANNED

I like Vic but he brought it on himself.

[ReplayRandall]

Originally Posted by cj

Vic worked hard for his banning.

I know, I know....But here's a quick question; If you HAD to let someone come back to the site between Vic and EMD, who would you end up reluctantly choosing?.....Both would have to give sincere PUBLIC apologies to ALL that were offended, to even be considered in the first place...

[HalvOnHorseracing]

I've interviewed a number of stewards (including one in CA). I've even gotten them to sit down with me and watch races (that I picked). It's interesting to listen to their analyses, and perhaps the most interesting thing is that they usually made sense in their arguments, even though there were races where they disagreed about whether a horse should be taken down. My unscientific study suggested that stewards are more likely to agree on stretch calls, but less likely to agree on backstretch fouls. There was one backstretch incident that I thought was a clear foul, and still had one of three stewards argue the horse shouldn't have been DQ'd (the horse wasn't by the way, and there wasn't even an inquiry).

I don't think I feel as harsh towards the stewards as some do, but I did become convinced that there is a rubric that permeates each respective set of stewards. Before a specific event occurs, they already have an idea of what is worthy of DQ and what is not, and it varies at least slightly from jurisdiction to jurisdiction. That's not to say there is perfect consistency within a jurisdiction, but they do seem to have patterns, even if they said, each inquiry is evaluated on its own merits.

It's sort of like the courts. How can a point of law wind up getting one decision in the district court, a different decision at the court of appeals, and a reversal at the Supreme Court by a 5-4 vote. Shouldn't it be clearer? As I said, what seems to be clear is that the rubric of the jurisdiction and the "politics" of the steward have a lot more to do with decisions than anybody wants to recognize.

There are only a couple of things that could be done to gain consistency. One, go to the central stewards concept, where all DQ decisions are made by a central authority of three or five or seven experts. Two, go to strict definitions of foul, and always rule a foul is a foul. That's how it used to be, and it sucked but it was consistent.

[HalvOnHorseracing]

Originally Posted by cj

Reality shows are the farthest thing from reality possible.

Reality is as they edit it.

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by ReplayRandall

I know, I know....But here's a quick question; If you HAD to let someone come back to the site between Vic and EMD, who would you end up reluctantly choosing?.....Both would have to give sincere PUBLIC apologies to ALL that were offended, to even be considered in the first place...

I'd pick EMD to come back...no contest.