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07-15-2019, 11:06 AM
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#766
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The Voice of Reason!
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Canandaigua, New york
Posts: 112,887
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Hand times might as well be made up.
Made probably closer to reality.
I know it's not your fault, it is the fault of incompetent racetracks taking the easy way out.
ALL TRACKS are capable of doing what CJ does with video.
Those that do not should NOT be played - EVER.
Frankly, IMHO, Equibase should have STANDARDS for accepting timings - ie, NO HAND TIMES ever accepted, used, printed, or stored.
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07-15-2019, 11:51 AM
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#767
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@TimeformUSfigs
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Moore, OK
Posts: 46,828
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ubercapper
Regarding CTM for 7/13. There are now hand times in the charts (and database) for races 2, 3, 4 and 7. The hand times for the other races will be in the chart and database shortly.
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7-14 have some races completely blank also. If they are going to wait and do it after the fact, I hope they are using video.
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07-15-2019, 01:24 PM
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#768
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cj
Canterbury, 7-3, R4. This race is mistimed about as badly as any you will ever see, at least 6 seconds too slow and probably more.
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I thought they ran that one at the wrong distance. I thought Arlington ran one at the wrong distance a few weeks ago too.
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07-15-2019, 03:15 PM
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#769
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@TimeformUSfigs
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Moore, OK
Posts: 46,828
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sjk
I thought they ran that one at the wrong distance. I thought Arlington ran one at the wrong distance a few weeks ago too.
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I thought so too when I saw the time but I don't think it was the case after watching and timing it.
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07-15-2019, 03:52 PM
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#770
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Queens, NY
Posts: 20,614
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom
Hand times might as well be made up.
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In mule racing the hand times often make more sense than the electronic times.
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"Unlearning is the highest form of learning"
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07-15-2019, 04:42 PM
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#771
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@TimeformUSfigs
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Moore, OK
Posts: 46,828
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Quote:
Originally Posted by classhandicapper
In mule racing the hand times often make more sense than the electronic times.
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Don't they time from the gate?
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07-15-2019, 06:52 PM
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#772
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Queens, NY
Posts: 20,614
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cj
Don't they time from the gate?
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Only when it theoretically works.
When it doesn't work or it's at a distance they don't time, they give a hand timed result. I spoke to someone at the organizing body about how trustworthy the hand times are and was assured that multiple people are timing the races because the times are so key to classing each mule. The hand times seem fine to me in most cases. Some of the electronic ones almost can't be right.
__________________
"Unlearning is the highest form of learning"
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07-15-2019, 06:57 PM
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#773
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@TimeformUSfigs
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Moore, OK
Posts: 46,828
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Quote:
Originally Posted by classhandicapper
Only when it theoretically works.
When it doesn't work or it's at a distance they don't time, they give a hand timed result. I spoke to someone at the organizing body about how trustworthy the hand times are and was assured that multiple people are timing the races because the times are so key to classing each mule. The hand times seem fine to me in most cases. Some of the electronic ones almost can't be right.
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Scary but unfortunately not surprising.
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07-15-2019, 09:36 PM
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#774
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 109
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When you see back-to-back double zero times like 22.00 45.00 ...... that's 10,000 to 1 .... automatically suspect in my book.
Very long time ago on a Nationally Televised horse race, one of the big name hosts told a story about when he was younger and in charge of reporting times (or something related to times) and how he ONCE made up a time he didn't have, and ended the story with "and nobody was ever the wiser."
All I thought was, "as far as you know ..... a-hole".
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07-16-2019, 09:05 AM
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#775
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@TimeformUSfigs
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Moore, OK
Posts: 46,828
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof.Factor
When you see back-to-back double zero times like 22.00 45.00 ...... that's 10,000 to 1 .... automatically suspect in my book.
Very long time ago on a Nationally Televised horse race, one of the big name hosts told a story about when he was younger and in charge of reporting times (or something related to times) and how he ONCE made up a time he didn't have, and ended the story with "and nobody was ever the wiser."
All I thought was, "as far as you know ..... a-hole".
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Any of the tracks you see listed in the old fifths (.00, .20, .40, etc) are all hand timed.
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07-16-2019, 10:18 AM
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#776
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The Voice of Reason!
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Canandaigua, New york
Posts: 112,887
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cj View Post
Don't they time from the gate?
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NYRA has a problem for that solution - put the gate in the wrong place!
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07-16-2019, 10:19 AM
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#777
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 109
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Yeah, I've been doing figs for 30 years, so kinda familiar with times.
Even the hand times converted to fifths is caveman-ish. I hand-timed all the races for 13th and 14th at CTM with my phone's stopwatch.
Still in hundreths and more than confident in accuracy. Timed 16th poles to nullify camera angle discrepancies. And since I bet with my information (as opposed to suppliers), I don't hesitate in re-timing to make sure I'm accurate.
Main reason I make my own figures is I use them to bet with while others that make figures might just be punching a clock.
I'm sure they are all not like you, CJ!
Last edited by Prof.Factor; 07-16-2019 at 10:20 AM.
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07-16-2019, 10:50 AM
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#778
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@TimeformUSfigs
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Moore, OK
Posts: 46,828
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof.Factor
Yeah, I've been doing figs for 30 years, so kinda familiar with times.
Even the hand times converted to fifths is caveman-ish. I hand-timed all the races for 13th and 14th at CTM with my phone's stopwatch.
Still in hundreths and more than confident in accuracy. Timed 16th poles to nullify camera angle discrepancies. And since I bet with my information (as opposed to suppliers), I don't hesitate in re-timing to make sure I'm accurate.
Main reason I make my own figures is I use them to bet with while others that make figures might just be punching a clock.
I'm sure they are all not like you, CJ!
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Cool, I certainly don't think I'm the only one out there doing this stuff. You probably wish I'd keep quiet!
I'm with you, been doing this since I was 18, and believe it or not I'm still learning new stuff all the time.
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07-16-2019, 11:15 AM
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#779
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cj
Cool, I certainly don't think I'm the only one out there doing this stuff. You probably wish I'd keep quiet!
I'm with you, been doing this since I was 18, and believe it or not I'm still learning new stuff all the time.
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You have to keep doing new things or you'll be left behind, as you well know.
I enjoy reading your posts too much, to worry about you being quiet. You're good at what you do.
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07-22-2019, 07:08 PM
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#780
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 109
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7-19-2019 AP race 8
FYI, not as big as you usually post, but I re-scored it a tick.
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